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Offline oksoda

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Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« on: May 14, 2015, 08:43:00 AM »

Like it or not, Nintendo’s recent patching practices suggest the company is more in line with major publishers than fans want to admit.

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/editorial/40249/nintendo-and-the-post-release-patch

I think most people agreed that it was highly unlikely that the upcoming Wii U Zelda game would actually release in 2015, as was originally announced by series producer Eiji Aonuma at The Game Awards in 2014. Still, when Aonuma recently revealed that the game would be delayed until 2016, it was a pretty big blow to this year’s Wii U line-up – we still don’t really know what’s coming after Yoshi’s Wooly World and Mario Maker this year. Slowly and surely, though, Nintendo fans, I among them, united under a familiar quote from Nintendo’s most iconic voice, Shigeru Miyamoto: “A delayed game is eventually good, but a rushed game is forever bad.”

That quote, when trotted out, isn’t typically meant to reassure Nintendo fans alone. It’s often used to differentiate Nintendo from other major publishers that seemingly push incomplete games out, only to release major patches down the road to fix and finalize them. Oh, you still can’t play the Master Chief Collection online? That’s why I like Nintendo – it would never do that.

Except, of course, that it would do that. And is doing that, actually.

In fact, two of Nintendo’s major first-party releases this year – and new IPs, to boot – have had or will have major post-launch patches that fundamentally change the out-of-the-box experience. Code Name: S.T.E.A.M., which released in March this year, was universally criticized for its laborious enemy turn times, which forced players to passively watch (or not watch, as the view was often obstructed by the level itself) as the AI enemy carefully repositioned its units around the map, which could take upwards of two minutes during bigger confrontations. It slowed the game to a crawl and was the major contributing factor to the game’s middling reviews.

During a Nintendo Direct last month, Nintendo announced that a major patch would be released in the near future to remedy the slow enemy movement by allowing players to fast forward (the speed of which depends on whether you’re playing on the OG 3DS or the *New* 3DS). A week later the patch was released, and just like that, the game’s most notorious issue was no more.

I guess there’s a glass half full/half empty debate to be had here. Was the patch diligently worked on and released by Nintendo in response to the unforeseen and sharp criticism, or was the ability to fast forward enemy movement willingly withheld in order to keep the game on its planned release schedule? Considering that Code Name: S.T.E.A.M. releases this month in Europe and Japan and the ability to fast forward will likely be available out of the box, I tend to see it from the half-empty view; Nintendo wanted the game out in North America this March, so concessions were made, knowing they could be fixed down the road.

Much more certain is Nintendo’s handling of Splatoon. Last week’s Nintendo Direct revealed that Nintendo would be “supporting” Splatoon throughout the summer with frequent updates and free additional content, including the ability to make a party with three of your friends and to create custom games. My immediate reaction was positive – free DLC! But thinking on it some more, and then discussing it on last week’s Nintendo News Report, it became clear to me; Nintendo isn’t planning to release additional content, it’s releasing the remaining content. Let’s be real here – in 2015, would we ever accept a competitive shooter being released without the ability to party with friends or host matches with custom settings? These are essential modes that won’t be available for months. Even Smash Bros. and Mario Kart 8, other marquee first-party titles, included these features from launch.

I’m a particularly big fan of EA’s NHL series, and last year’s iteration, NHL 15, was slammed for releasing without standard modes, including the ability to play online with teams completely controlled by human players. The modes were promised to be included in future patches – and were – but the damage had been done by that point. Bring up NHL 15, and you’ll mostly hear about what wasn’t there at the start, no matter what’s available to players now.

The announcement that expected modes would be patched in up to three months after Splatoon releases seemed to come and go without much criticism, which I understand to a point. Nintendo, while known for making questionable decisions on a business-level, typically gets the benefit of the doubt when it comes to the actual games. The Miyamoto quote helps support that. But, the handling of these two major first-party releases suggests that Nintendo isn’t above the practice of major post-launch patches, and it will be interesting to see if reviews of Splatoon are negatively impacted by the obvious omission of standard modes and, subsequently, if the game can rise above that when those modes are eventually available.

In the meantime, I’d like to suggest a revision to Miyamoto’s famous quote: “A delayed game is eventually good, but a rushed game is bad until the post-release patch(es).”


Offline Ian Sane

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Relase Patch
« Reply #1 on: May 14, 2015, 05:35:37 PM »
With S.T.E.A.M. I thought the design was deliberate.  The idea being that you're supposed to observe the other team's moves and if you can't see it that's all part of the strategy.  Get into a better position next time, right?  Maybe I'm wrong but in the demo it didn't feel unfinished but just an idea that requires a little more open-mindedness than one should expect from a typical gamer.  So I figured they tried that idea out, it did not go over well and then they made a patch for it.

But that is what I thought well before this Splatoon stuff and in THAT case it certainly seems deliberate.  But then they're announcing it now while S.T.E.A.M. gave no indication that a fix was on the way.

I get it though because the real big problem Nintendo faces right now is "holy ****, there are no games coming out!"  They're desperate and justifiably so and I think it looks good for Nintendo that very dire circumstances forced them to rush this stuff while someone like EA doesn't have that excuse.  With Nintendo I feel like it's an emergency (we'll see what they do if they're not under the gun) while with other companies it feels like taking their customers for a ride because they can get away with it.

Offline Enner

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Relase Patch
« Reply #2 on: May 14, 2015, 05:57:32 PM »
With Code name STEAM, I'm conflicted on the half-empty/half-full dichotomy. On half-full, I'd have to acknowledge that Intelligent Systems thought the waiting was not a problem or was a unique twist. Strategy games are ponderous enough as they are, so it is hard to think that an accomplished strategy game developer would think having more down time is better or acceptable. On half-empty, well, that's a cynical business move.


With Splatoon, I'm curious to know at release if the data for updates are already on the disc. Some of the maps in the future updates are featured in video and screenshots since last year. Splatoon has the grace of being a new IP as well as a Nintendo game which is why it's "updates" aren't as scrutinized as NHL '15. Sad to say, but it is normal to expect some amount of oddity with Nintendo games, especially when it comes to periphery stuff (Yeah, I just called "having enough maps" and "matchmaking with friends" periphery stuff... ugh.).


And of course, the cynical view is that content was excised out of Splatoon in a ploy to extend its longevity in the news cycles and the hands of players.

Offline Mop it up

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Relase Patch
« Reply #3 on: May 14, 2015, 06:27:37 PM »
This isn't the first time they've done this sort of thing either: Mario Kart 8 felt rushed out the door.

It was nice when Nintendo were above things like this, but they had this luxury during the Wii and DS since they were the market leader. Presently, the Wii U is a flop, and although the 3DS was eventually successful, Nintendo still went through several straight years of losses. They were desperate for profit any way they could get it, so of course they've started rolling out the questionable practices of other companies such as patches, frivolous DLC, and of course, the toxin that is amiibo.

I don't see this changing any either, not after Nintendo's gotten a taste of the money this stuff can make. From a business perspective, I can't really blame them: being themselves no longer makes money, so they had little choice but to follow the unfortunate state of the industry.

Offline TOPHATANT123

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Relase Patch
« Reply #4 on: May 14, 2015, 07:25:26 PM »
Games weren't perfect before patches, they can be a force for good if they aren't abused and Nintendo are by no means above releasing unfinished games (Wind Waker anyone?). Smash Brothers Melee had balance "patches" between each release but due to technology they couldn't be applied to each territory, Majoras Mask had a "patch" in the form of owl statues but only for the West, Fire Emblem for Gamecube had been "patched" to inculde higher difficulties, Fatal Frame 2 had a game breaking bug and subsequently was never released in the US, Metroid Other M had game breaking bugs, Skyward Sword had game breaking bugs.


X/Y, Smash Bros and Tropical Freeze also had game breaking bugs but this time round they were able to be fixed in a way that didn't involve sending your SD card to Nintendo.

Offline ObbyDent

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Relase Patch
« Reply #5 on: May 14, 2015, 07:39:38 PM »
Just pointing out a typo in the headline: "Relase" vs. "Release"

Offline TOPHATANT123

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Relase Patch
« Reply #6 on: May 14, 2015, 07:49:15 PM »
Just pointing out a typo in the headline: "Relase" vs. "Release"
Oh my how ironic for an article about releasing unfinished products  :P:

Offline Triforce Hermit

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Relase Patch
« Reply #7 on: May 14, 2015, 07:57:17 PM »
Except Nintendo is using patches as they are meant to be used. To fix problems and to tweak gameplay for balance. They aren't using it to fix an unfinished game that was rushed and released as a broken piece of crap. I'm not downloading a 30gb day one patch for Nintendo.

Splatoon I'm wagering is sort of a promotional thing. Release new content that was held back throughout the summer. Keep your players coming back. Not a very good idea, but better then the industry standard which is to hold back content then sell it back to you later
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Offline Evan_B

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #8 on: May 15, 2015, 12:30:46 AM »
I think that patches and DLC are a massive and necessary part of the Wii U's life simply because the library is so small. These minor improvements and additions give players a reason to return to the game. In the case of Splatoon, a title that revolves around a steady multiplayer environment, the patches are less for unfinished content and more for perpetuating that community.

In the case of STEAM, I don't think the patch drastically change a thing, it simply addresses an issue that many found with the game. I think that's more forgivable than content being unavailable post launch.
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Offline xcwarrior

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #9 on: May 15, 2015, 12:55:19 PM »
Basically it tells me, "Don't bother buying games Day 1... it's not done until around Day 30-100."
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Offline Ian Sane

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #10 on: May 15, 2015, 01:21:40 PM »
The day one patch is ruining the appeal of physical releases.  There is a certain security in a physical release that is lost if a download is necessary for the game to play correctly.  Retro gaming in 20 years is going to be weird.  You'll buy an old disc of a game and then realize that it's missing content and is full of bugs.

I bought the Mass Effect Trilogy last year for the PS3.  Aside from the free extending ending download I realized that the original PS3 version of ME2 did not have the ability to import your character from the first game, simply because the first game was originally an Xbox 360 exclusive so it had no reason to have that feature so they patched that functionality in for the Trilogy release.  I remember thinking "gee if my PS3 breaks way in the future and I get a used one after the downloads are not available anymore I guess I won't be able to import my character."  It's nothing that outright ruins the game but it's lame and makes my insistence on getting a physical release a little silly.

If these post-release patch features of Splatoon seem essential to you, then the only real reason to bother with the physical release is to save hard drive space.

Offline NWR_Lindy

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #11 on: May 16, 2015, 03:30:14 PM »
In Splatoon's case I think the game is deliberately unfinished in order to make a summer release. Of course, "unfinished" is in the eye of the beholder, but they're adding key features (not just content, such as new maps) months after release.  I don't think this is a heinous offense, but Nintendo shouldn't be given a pass on it either.

Fanboys used to love to trot out the fact that Nintendo didn't need to do DLC because their retail releases contained all their content on day one, but those days are clearly in the past. I think this is all part of Nintendo coming to grips with the challenges of balancing HD development while adhering to tight delivery schedules.

On the topic of Halo MCC, that game actually did contain all content at release. The online was horrendously broken but they didn't patch in any FEATURES after the fact. They had to fix features that were already there, granted, but all core features were included in the retail release, as I recall. Post-release they've added different game modes to playlists and whatnot, but those are variations on what's already there.
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Offline nickmitch

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #12 on: May 16, 2015, 08:37:27 PM »
I think the STEAM situation was reactionary.  I mean, how much work was it to add that?  Would it have really taken months to implement at launch?  With Splatoon, THAT seems deliberate since it's THE summer release and any online feature would require some extensive testing (I would think).  Not to say level packs couldn't be used in the same way; a developer can give enough to satisfy initial buyers, then put out a few already finished levels to keep up buzz.  But that isn't as bad when the content is "free".
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Offline Adrock

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #13 on: May 16, 2015, 09:28:56 PM »
I was never a fan of patches, particularly day one patches. However, I now see them as necessary evils. Games have gotten more complex and more difficult to develop. I was a strong advocate of "make it right the first time," and I'd still like to see the effort so I only bemoan patches on a case by case basis.

That said, I can't really support what is being done with Splatoon. The game is very clearly being rushed. Nintendo has a history of offering free DLC, but these aren't merely nice bonuses. They're major features and substantial parts of the game still being worked on, and Nintendo is releasing the game anyway to fill a massive gap in its release schedule. Nintendo should be mildly commended for not charging extra (since, let's be honest here, most companies would), but I don't think Nintendo should get a pass.

Offline NWR_insanolord

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #14 on: May 16, 2015, 09:38:30 PM »
I was never a fan of patches, particularly day one patches. However, I now see them as necessary evils. Games have gotten more complex and more difficult to develop. I was a strong advocate of "make it right the first time," and I'd still like to see the effort so I only bemoan patches on a case by case basis.

That said, I can't really support what is being done with Splatoon. The game is very clearly being rushed. Nintendo has a history of offering free DLC, but these aren't merely nice bonuses. They're major features and substantial parts of the game still being worked on, and Nintendo is releasing the game anyway to fill a massive gap in its release schedule. Nintendo should be mildly commended for not charging extra (since, let's be honest here, most companies would), but I don't think Nintendo should get a pass.

They're not charging for them, and they're being completely up-front and transparent about what's happening, which are two big marks in their favor compared to some other times this has happened with other companies, but it's still a bad precedent.

With S.T.E.A.M. it seems like Nintendo just didn't foresee people having that negative a reaction to it taking that long between turns. They did it the way they did consciously, and only changed it because people were upset. As far as I'm concerned that's a huge positive in having the ability to patch, that they were able to make that change after the fact in response to complaints.
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Offline Adrock

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #15 on: May 16, 2015, 10:25:53 PM »
I'm confused. It sounds like you're correcting me, but then you just reiterated what I said.

I appreciate Nintendo's honesty (and the fact that it's offering the update free of charge), but willingly releasing an unfinished game is still shitty, and Nintendo is doing that more and more frequently as of late. Splatoon looks like a really great game to buy in a few months.

Offline NWR_insanolord

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #16 on: May 16, 2015, 10:37:51 PM »
Sorry, I didn't mean for it to come off that way, I was just expanding on/agreeing with what you said.
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Offline nickmitch

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #17 on: May 16, 2015, 11:33:56 PM »
Splatoon looks like a really great game to buy in a few months.

Nintendo's consoles are starting to get that way too.  Great to buy about a year after launch.  But I guess that's every console.
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Offline NWR_insanolord

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #18 on: May 17, 2015, 12:23:21 AM »
Yeah, buying pretty much any console right at launch doesn't make a ton of sense when you really think about it.
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Offline pokepal148

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #19 on: May 17, 2015, 02:43:15 AM »
"A delayed game is eventually good, a bad game can be rushed to the market and passed off as good when it gets patched."

Offline Enner

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #20 on: May 17, 2015, 04:24:14 AM »
Heh.

Splatoon at launch isn't a bad game. Just severely lacking in features and content that is expected of its genre. I'm curious as to how long Splatoon will see new stuff and support after August 2015. Maybe that's when Nintendo will drop the premium DLC hammer.

Offline Luigi Dude

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #21 on: May 17, 2015, 11:44:08 AM »
I'd rather Nintendo finish games with patches then be stuck with rushed games that are incomplete forever like Mario Sunshine and Wind Waker.  Seriously, if the Gamecube had the ability to patch games people would have been begging Ninendo to do it since many of its biggest titles were rushed as well.  The only difference between then and now is Nintendo can actually finish the games after release and even fix some major problems these games have as well had instead of blatantly releasing unfinished games with major issues that will always be that way.
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Offline Adrock

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #22 on: May 17, 2015, 12:37:38 PM »
I don't think the debate is whether a company should finish a rushed game via patches. I believe most people would agree if a company rushes a game, it should make sure its game is the one promised to consumers, not a working game missing key features or at worst a broken, incomplete mess. Rather, the debate is whether a company should rush an incomplete game to market in the first place. It means a company is beholden to release dates rather than the state of its products. This is becoming a common theme in the industry. Nintendo was like the last holdout, and it's a shame that even Nintendo couldn't continue to fight the good fight in this regard, either by choice or the demands of the market.

Offline nickmitch

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #23 on: May 17, 2015, 01:19:43 PM »
"A delayed game is eventually good, a bad game can be rushed to the market and passed off as good when it gets patched."

But then again, Duke Nukem Forever.
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Offline Luigi Dude

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Re: Nintendo and the Post-Release Patch
« Reply #24 on: May 17, 2015, 06:35:40 PM »
This is becoming a common theme in the industry. Nintendo was like the last holdout, and it's a shame that even Nintendo couldn't continue to fight the good fight in this regard, either by choice or the demands of the market.

But they weren't, during the Gamecube era Nintendo was rushing games out in order to meet dates for that system as well.  Nintendo made it clear over a decade ago they will rush games out if their system is struggling and needs games.  I agree it's sad much of the industry is releasing unfinished games that they just fix later but Nintendo releasing unfinished games to help fill their schedule isn't really a new thing.
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