Author Topic: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread  (Read 13905 times)

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Offline Yoshidious

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RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« on: October 26, 2009, 01:54:19 PM »
This is the official forum thread for discussing the winner of our recent Genesis poll, Shining Force II. Please make sure your posts are on topic. Comments from this thread may be quoted on Radio Free Nintendo during our RetroActive segments.

Shining Force II is available on Virtual Console for 800 points. We encourage all podcast listeners to play it with fresh eyes and post your thoughts here!
« Last Edit: October 26, 2009, 01:56:50 PM by Yoshidious »
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Offline NWR_DrewMG

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2009, 03:03:06 PM »
I'm maybe 4-5 battles in now, playing on the Ouch! difficulty level.  I'm finding the sprite movement mechanics in the game (exploring the overworld) to be more dated than I remember, and the menu system is a bit clunky.  I still like the "4 items per character" rule and think it adds a lot of strategy to the game.  The music is really what's taking me back more than anything else. 

The story is pretty standard fantasy INEXPERIENCED GOOD VS. ANCIENT EVIL fare, but it's told well enough. 

I loved this game in middle school when I first got it (it was a Christmas present in 8th grade) and I still love it now.  One of my all time faves.
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Offline Stratos

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2009, 12:46:53 AM »
The King looks like freaking Santa Clause. LOL

I have not fought a battle yet, but the first thing I've notice is that other allies follow you around the town and it is very fluid movement. Some previous games I have played like Dragon Quest 3 have your allies following along rather woodenly from grid to grid, but here they flow a bit more naturally behind you.
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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #3 on: October 27, 2009, 01:06:32 AM »
Bah. I forgot to snag my Sonic's Ultimate Genesis Collection disc when I was home last weekend. Guess I'll have to wait to join the fun until next weekend. :(
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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #4 on: October 27, 2009, 01:37:35 AM »
LOL, best quote ever:

"But it's OK if he dies, he's old anyway".

Must be mentioned on the podcast.
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Offline noname2200

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #5 on: October 27, 2009, 03:28:13 PM »
Sweet choice. I enjoyed this game, but never had a chance to finish it. I really doubt I will this time either, but I'll give it my best.

I have to second NWR DrewMG about the clunkiness of the menu though.

Offline vudu

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #6 on: October 27, 2009, 04:06:39 PM »
The game is a very simplified mix of Fire Emblem and Final Fantasy games of the day (I - VI).

Gone are the intricacies of Fire Emblem.  As far as I can there there is no weapon triangle.  Very rarely do characters counter-attack or double-attack and since there's no way to know before it happens you can't plan for it.  You can't even tell how much damage you will deal before a fight takes place!  Death is irrelevant because there's almost no penalty for falling in battle.  In fact, it seems you can actually "game" the system by purposefully losing or fleeing from battle at the very end and then start over with all your experience from the previous encounter intact.

Similarly, while Shining Force seems to share a lot in common with RPGs of the day the game is missing a lot of complexities that are assumed to be there.  There don't seem to be any stat-boosting equipment or items other than weapons.  Because it's a strategy game it is completely linear so you don't get any of the freedom you come to expect from an RPG.

I've only completed the first 7 battles so it's possible that armor and additional items will be introduced later in the game.  Unfortunately, I don't expect the other short-comings will be resolved because they're built into the basic framework of the game.

This isn't to say that I don't enjoy the game.  I am enjoying it and I expect to play it to completion.  I'm just a bit let down after hearing so many great things about the game.  I'm also completely miffed that Slade the thief doesn't seem to be able to do any thieving!  What good is a thief who can't steal?
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Offline gtownclown

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #7 on: October 28, 2009, 10:31:47 AM »
I remember playing this game as a kid and have been waiting for it to come out on vc but I thought it was shinning force 3 so I’m glad this game was chosen. Because now I realize this game that has been out for a while is actually the one I’ve been waiting on.  I’m only about 1.5 hours in maybe a little more and I remember the appeal this game had so vividly now. I have some complaints right up front with it that my former kid self didn’t have. First the dialogue is so so so bad. They have just enough info in the statements to make it tolerable to care about the story line. Hopefully it gets a lot better further in but I’m not gonna hold my breath on that one. And my second complaint it why didn’t they give themselves enough room in the class or job description box to type out all of the job descriptions. It is just one of those things that by being over looked makes this game come across in the first 15 minutes as crap when it really isn’t….well not at least from what I remember.

Offline NWR_DrewMG

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2009, 09:05:51 AM »
I remember playing this game as a kid and have been waiting for it to come out on vc but I thought it was shinning force 3 so I’m glad this game was chosen.

I had the real Shining Force III for Saturn for awhile.  It was pretty hard to track down, as it was released at the end of the Saturn's life and not very many copies were made.

Interestingly, the game was split up in Japan into three separate scenarios, all sold separately.  Supposedly, you could really only get the true ending at the end of the third scenario, because the game story was basically retold from three points of view. 

Only the first scenario was released in the US, and I only played through half of it - the story was pretty convoluted and complicated from what I remember.  The gameplay was more or less the same as the previous Shining Force titles, however. 

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #9 on: October 30, 2009, 07:05:09 AM »
Is it just me or do some of the enemies seem really powerful? The first time I had to fight enemy swordsmen they seemed to do an awful amount of damage to most of my fighting units. Are you guys having issues with this or am I missing something?
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Offline vudu

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #10 on: October 30, 2009, 01:35:10 PM »
I don't think I've run into a swordsman yet.  I completed battle #9 yesterday (the second battle after they relocate the village).  When do they start to appear?

The strongest enemy I've encountered so far is the Vampire Bat.
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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #11 on: October 30, 2009, 06:27:09 PM »
Sorry, the axemen. I forgot their real names. the first human armed warriors you fight in the game.
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Offline gojira

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #12 on: October 31, 2009, 01:01:25 PM »
The game is a very simplified mix of Fire Emblem and Final Fantasy games of the day (I - VI).

Gone are the intricacies of Fire Emblem.  As far as I can there there is no weapon triangle. 

I know it's a small detail.  But the weapon triangle mechanic of the Fire Emblem series came after Shining Force II was released.  So you can't really fault it for that. 

Offline vudu

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #13 on: October 31, 2009, 03:41:16 PM »
I can't fault the game for not coming up with something original?  ;)
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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #14 on: November 01, 2009, 12:02:04 AM »
I can't fault the game for not coming up with something original?  ;)

True, it wasn't exactly a ground breaking game.  But it did take pretty much everything from the first Shining Force and improve upon it.  And since the Fire Emblem series had no presence in the West at that time, it has nothing else to directly compare with.

Offline gtownclown

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #15 on: November 02, 2009, 09:02:26 AM »
Ok so after playing this for hours and hours now, I have my opinions locked in. this game has a lot of good things that are done just a little off to make them not good.
 My first example is the music. I really like the music a lot….. But during battles every time the screen changes it has to start the song over again. And the music that plays as you are moving the characters on the field has a very noticeable intro to the song. And you get to hear it every 30-60 seconds. It got to the point that I had to turn the music way down to not get frustrated. My second example of something just a little off that is a lot of fun in theory is the leveling system.
 The characters level pretty quickly and get promotions with a new picture for the character. They even hold new weapons when you buy them and equip them. So it keeps somewhat interesting to buy new weapons and promote characters. But when a character has fallen by the side lines in a couple of battles all of the sudden it is impossible to get them caught back up without totally screwing around the entire battle getting enemies to 1 hp and then moving that character in for the kill. This is annoying.
 I remember playing this as a kid and my turtle being one of my best people and this time he didn’t get to finish off the enemy in a couple battles and now he is a total suck fest. I’m going through the trouble of getting him kills just because I know how useful he can be.
 I love the big battles that make even the small leveling battles seam important. This is a lot different than games I played at the same time like ff6. Which you end up grinding forever and it never takes any brains. With these battles even the grinding feels somewhat difficult. The balancing is done very well in this game.
The characters are diverse and interesting. That cute little turtles attack is fucking adorable. All in all I like this game a lot.
It was a good game to play as a kid about the same time as ff6 and it is still a good game today. If you can get past the dialogue which has gotten better but still sucks pretty freaking bad.

Offline gojira

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #16 on: November 02, 2009, 10:03:08 AM »
The whole thing about characters being left behind is very true.  It's also the case for other SRPGs like Fire Emblem.  Which is why I loved the bonus EXP feature in the GameCube game. 

Offline vudu

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #17 on: November 02, 2009, 01:54:23 PM »
When do I actually get to start controlling Peter?
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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #18 on: November 02, 2009, 02:03:55 PM »
The whole thing about characters being left behind is very true.  It's also the case for other SRPGs like Fire Emblem.  Which is why I loved the bonus EXP feature in the GameCube game.

Yeah, this happens in a lot of RPGs, not just the FE/SF SRPGs.

That is the great thing about games like Knights of the Old Reublic and (I think) Chrono Trigger where all of your characters, active and inactive, share your experience and level up together.

Though the second US GBA Fire Emblem had a lot of open-ended encounters and the 'endless' towers you could keep repeating to train some of your alts. But the bonus EXP system on the GC/Wii games was a different breakthrough all together because you could actually max out your non-combat units to level 20 and promote them. I had never done that before the GC Fe.

It's always frustrating when you get a core set of characters you always use and then one battle comes up that let's you use twice as many characters as normal so you have a bunch of weak unused characters taking the battlefield.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2009, 02:05:44 PM by Stratos »
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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #19 on: November 02, 2009, 06:56:38 PM »
Shining Force has always stood out for me as the only game I am aware of that combines strategy RPG type battles and traditional "exploration" type gameplay (i.e. walking around towns and the overworld). Games like Fire Emblem or Final Fantasy Tactics are nothing but a bunch of battles strung one after another, which becomes tedious after awhile. Unfortunately, neither the combat or the exploration in this game are really up to par with other RPGs. It is as a whole package where I think the game stands out.

I also like the music.


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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #20 on: November 05, 2009, 12:15:24 PM »
I guess in the end my complaint isn’t that my characters fell behind. I’m used to that in ff games and other rpg’s but it is just how fast the characters were pushed out of the group. It was just a couple of battles where they weren’t getting the kills. Then they were useless before I even realized it. and there hits are only doing like 1 or 2 damage so it is very hard to get the enemies close enough to death without killing them to get things evened out. I’m going through the process but it is just frustrating. An easy fix would be low level allies should pull extra exp for killing high level enemies. That would help even it out faster or something. Which might be already in place but I haven’t noticed it. I notice the reverse is true where upgraded allies get less experience for killing low level enemies which kind of has the same effect with evening out but just a lot slower and indirectly.

Offline Jonnyboy117

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #21 on: November 05, 2009, 06:08:10 PM »
I'm still early in the game, but it seems there are some built-in methods for catching up characters who have been "left behind" in levels. You can have them take pot shots at enemies out of their league, because they'll still get experience for the hit even if it does little damage. If a character knows magic, you can have him spam that (even healing) to gain experience without direct battle. Do you get experience for using items? I haven't tried it yet, but it seems possible given how the game rewards everything else. If all else fails, you can wait until new equipment is available for the character, and purchase that, which will artificially boost his stats, hopefully to the point that he can be somewhat useful in combat and start to catch up.

I do think the leveling up could get lopsided, due to the fact that killing an enemy provides far more experience than doing damage to it. But as gtownclown explained, this system can also be leveraged to boost characters who have fallen behind.
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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #22 on: November 05, 2009, 06:51:03 PM »
Do people actually use Slade? He seems to be terribly weak.
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Offline NWR_DrewMG

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #23 on: November 05, 2009, 07:26:31 PM »
I'm trying to get Slade to a usable state, but it's tricky.  He's really weak.
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Offline vudu

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #24 on: November 05, 2009, 07:32:19 PM »
Do people actually use Slade? He seems to be terribly weak.

Apparently he gets really good after promotion.  In the Fire Emblem games I always tend to like both thieves/assassins and swordsmen--both weak but fast classes--so I'll probably try to stick with him.
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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #25 on: November 05, 2009, 10:53:56 PM »
Do you get experience for using items? I haven't tried it yet, but it seems possible given how the game rewards everything else.

If I remember correctly, healers get some exp when using healing items.  Other characters just get 1 exp.

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #26 on: November 06, 2009, 03:38:07 AM »
Do you get experience for using items? I haven't tried it yet, but it seems possible given how the game rewards everything else.

If I remember correctly, healers get some exp when using healing items.  Other characters just get 1 exp.

That is correct. I kinda wish you got more if they were better items.

It is a little frustrating that you are stuck with a limited amount of mana each battle because I tend to spam my healers in Fire Emblem to level them up faster so I can promote them at 20. Hard to spam healers in Shining Force when they run out of mana after a couple heals.
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Offline vudu

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #27 on: November 06, 2009, 01:49:56 PM »
It is a little frustrating that you are stuck with a limited amount of mana each battle because I tend to spam my healers in Fire Emblem to level them up faster so I can promote them at 20. Hard to spam healers in Shining Force when they run out of mana after a couple heals.

Healers generally don't even get that much experience from using healing spells--usually around 10 or 15 exp. points.

Every time it's practical, when I weaken an enemy to 1 or 2 HP I finish him off with either Sarah or Kazin so they get 49 exp. points.  Even if it takes a couple turns to get them in place and attack it's not a big deal since you generally don't need to worry about your units counter-attacking--and therefore killing--the weakened enemy when he attacks your units.

So far I've had zero problems keeping all my units at around the same level (~14 by battle 12).
Why must all things be so bright? Why can things not appear only in hues of brown! I am so serious about this! Dull colors are the future! The next generation! I will never accept a world with such bright colors! It is far too childish! I will rage against your cheery palette with my last breath!

Offline Jonnyboy117

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #28 on: November 11, 2009, 12:49:32 AM »
I've seen some interesting things as I continue through the game.

- I got into a random battle. I'm pretty sure it was random, because I was walking through a region of the overworld that I'd been to before (I was just searching around for extra stuff, and there wasn't any). The enemies were of the same level as other battles in that part of the game.

- An enemy dropped an item during battle. It was a Power Ring, which increases your Attack stat by 5 points.

- Slade is actually quite good once you can buy the Dagger for him. He has high agility, so he can approach enemies from far away and then escape if his HP get low. I also love the Tortoise because his movement seems unaffected by terrain, and his defense is ridiculous. I started to like Chester once he got better attack range.

- Sarah is easier to level up once she learns the Blast spell, which attacks enemies. It's cheap, too, so it makes her useful even after her MP gets too low to keep healing people. I also keep her stocked with herbs so she can heal after consuming all her MP.

- The cave battle was interesting, due to the darkness giving a "fog of war" kind of affect. I also noticed that May's arrows had shorter range in the dark.
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Offline NWR_DrewMG

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #29 on: November 11, 2009, 09:42:52 AM »
You're further than I am, Jonny.  I'm hoping to put some more time into this tonight, so I can write something in the forums about the game before the next show.

How about Peter the Phoenix?  He's pretty badass.
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Offline vudu

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #30 on: November 11, 2009, 01:53:07 PM »
- I got into a random battle. I'm pretty sure it was random, because I was walking through a region of the overworld that I'd been to before (I was just searching around for extra stuff, and there wasn't any). The enemies were of the same level as other battles in that part of the game.

It's actually not a true "random battle".  Oddly enough, you most likely repeated the same battle I did, which was battle #8 (the first battle after the village relocates to the mainland where the goal is to save the fallen worker).  After I completed battle #9 I went exploring (same as you) and wandered into the upper path of the main field, not realizing that was where the previous battle took place.  On my way back to the main field I got sucked into the same battle I had completed earlier, with the same enemies and placement.  Since I didn't want to over-level my characters I just escaped the battle using Bowie's magic.
Why must all things be so bright? Why can things not appear only in hues of brown! I am so serious about this! Dull colors are the future! The next generation! I will never accept a world with such bright colors! It is far too childish! I will rage against your cheery palette with my last breath!

Offline Jonnyboy117

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #31 on: November 11, 2009, 03:51:14 PM »
Yes, that's where I ran into it. So it's not random, just repeatable, eh? Still, it could be useful if you want to grind a bit.

Peter seems awesome, but I haven't gained control of him yet. The AI often has him flying around the start area, long after the battle's front has moved across the map.
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Offline vudu

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #32 on: November 11, 2009, 04:11:32 PM »
Peter seems awesome, but I haven't gained control of him yet. The AI often has him flying around the start area, long after the battle's front has moved across the map.

I had the same problem with Peter.  I poked around GameFAQS a bit, trying to figure out when I'd finally get to control him, and it seems like most of the people on their message board have the opposite gripe.  They complained that CPU-controlled Peter was an experience hog because he would single-handedly wipe out the opposing force before the other fighters could get any good hits in.  Odd indeed.

I also love the Tortoise because his movement seems unaffected by terrain, and his defense is ridiculous.

Ug.  I gave up using Kiwi because he kept dying after a single hit.  He only has 7 HP to start out and any time a magic user targeted him he was toast.
« Last Edit: November 11, 2009, 04:14:43 PM by vudu »
Why must all things be so bright? Why can things not appear only in hues of brown! I am so serious about this! Dull colors are the future! The next generation! I will never accept a world with such bright colors! It is far too childish! I will rage against your cheery palette with my last breath!

Offline Stratos

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #33 on: November 12, 2009, 04:12:05 AM »
Peter is floats aimlessly for me. Maybe that only happens if you either take too long to kill some enemies or enemies get too close to him along his path.
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Offline vudu

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #34 on: November 12, 2009, 02:20:17 PM »
Oh, if an enemy enters his attack range he'll kill it mercilessly.  But that never seems to happen because if there's nothing he can attack immediately he only moves a square or two instead of to the end or his range.  It seems the CPU is unwilling to put Peter into an enemy's attack range unless he's attacking another enemy.  I suppose it's for the best because it would be rather infuriating if Peter kept dying because the CPU was too aggressive.
Why must all things be so bright? Why can things not appear only in hues of brown! I am so serious about this! Dull colors are the future! The next generation! I will never accept a world with such bright colors! It is far too childish! I will rage against your cheery palette with my last breath!

Offline Jonnyboy117

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #35 on: November 12, 2009, 05:33:56 PM »
Ug.  I gave up using Kiwi because he kept dying after a single hit.  He only has 7 HP to start out and any time a magic user targeted him he was toast.

Try to keep him away from magic users. It's called strategy, man!
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Offline vudu

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #36 on: November 12, 2009, 05:38:21 PM »
It just doesn't seem worth it.  He might have fantastic defense, but since his HP and magic resistance are so low he'll always be less useful than a more-rounded character.  Later, when you have more characters in your party than can participate in a battle, you'll need to start choosing which characters you keep and and which will be permanently sidelined.  I already know Kiwi doesn't stand a chance in my final roster so I'm better off dumping him now so the characters I do want to keep get the extra experience.  Now that's strategy.  ;)
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Offline Stratos

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #37 on: November 12, 2009, 06:01:46 PM »
It always bugged me in SRPGs and RPGs in general that you end up with a bajillion allies that end up sitting around being useless. Either make more of the battles allow more characters in them or give a way to keep less played characters relevant or just don't give them to us.
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Offline vudu

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #38 on: November 12, 2009, 06:40:31 PM »
In Fire Emblem it makes sense to give you more characters than you need since they can die permanently--although Shadow Dragon went a bit overboard by giving you an endless supply of generic characters if you ran short on fighters.  However, in Shining Force II it doesn't make much sense since characters don't die.  And since some characters are inherently better than others, it's hard to argue that they did it so you can customize your party to your liking.  The only reason you'd want to pick some of these characters is if you've played the game before and want a semi-different experience.
Why must all things be so bright? Why can things not appear only in hues of brown! I am so serious about this! Dull colors are the future! The next generation! I will never accept a world with such bright colors! It is far too childish! I will rage against your cheery palette with my last breath!

Offline vudu

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #39 on: November 15, 2009, 06:45:03 PM »
I listened to RFN 169 this weekend.  There were some criticisms against my claim that death is irrelevant and I wanted to refute them here.

The crew claimed that the punishment for death was that your characters couldn't get any more experience that battle and thus could fall behind, potentially hurting you in future battles.  To that I say Pbppppppt.  You're not thinking big enough.  Death is meaningless.  You could have a character 10 levels behind the rest of your team and still raise his or her level up to that of the rest of the teams' if you have enough patience.

Let's say Chester is at level 10 when everyone else is at level 20.  If you have him kill two characters during a level he'll gain an entire level.  Just enter a battle and don't kill anyone unless it's with Chester.  When he dies, flee the battle, bring him back to life at a church, and repeat the process.  You'll be able to bring him up to the rest of the party within a half hour.

Advice for Greg regarding leveling up Sarah:  MP is automatically refilled before every battle.  Therefore, you should never finish a battle with leftover MP for Sarah.  Heal everyone--even if they don't need to be healed--just so she gets the experience.  Sarah should easily be able to gain 1 full level each battle from healing alone.
Why must all things be so bright? Why can things not appear only in hues of brown! I am so serious about this! Dull colors are the future! The next generation! I will never accept a world with such bright colors! It is far too childish! I will rage against your cheery palette with my last breath!

Offline Jonnyboy117

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #40 on: November 15, 2009, 11:34:16 PM »
Death is meaningless...  if you have enough patience.

You could say that about almost any video game. Fire Emblem is a very rare exception. I don't think all other games, even in the same genre, should be held to that same standard.
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Offline gojira

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #41 on: November 16, 2009, 12:37:21 AM »
It always bugged me in SRPGs and RPGs in general that you end up with a bajillion allies that end up sitting around being useless. Either make more of the battles allow more characters in them or give a way to keep less played characters relevant or just don't give them to us.

Good point vudu about Fire Emblem and the permanent deaths. 

The reason why they have so many characters is for replay value.  This is clear when you take into consideration the parts where you specifically have to choose certain characters over others.  Or the fact that there are secret characters to find.  Sure 'magic user A' may be better than 'magic user B', but you don't know that until you level them up.  Remember this game came out well before gamefaqs.com.  Being a person who has played the game several times, it's interesting having the ability to go with different characters.  The last time I played I choose all the powerhouses.  This time it's more the characters I like. 

But it does bother the OCD in me that wants to level up every character the first time through. 

Offline Stratos

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Re: RetroActive #10: Shining Force II Discussion Thread
« Reply #42 on: November 16, 2009, 04:12:15 AM »
Death is meaningless...  if you have enough patience.

You could say that about almost any video game. Fire Emblem is a very rare exception. I don't think all other games, even in the same genre, should be held to that same standard.

And even in Fire Emblem you just exercise enough patience to restart the level every time a unit dies. The only time I leave them permanently dead is if I get so tired of losing the same unit that I just decide to keep going.

It always bugged me in SRPGs and RPGs in general that you end up with a bajillion allies that end up sitting around being useless. Either make more of the battles allow more characters in them or give a way to keep less played characters relevant or just don't give them to us.

Good point vudu about Fire Emblem and the permanent deaths. 

The reason why they have so many characters is for replay value.  This is clear when you take into consideration the parts where you specifically have to choose certain characters over others.  Or the fact that there are secret characters to find.  Sure 'magic user A' may be better than 'magic user B', but you don't know that until you level them up.  Remember this game came out well before gamefaqs.com.  Being a person who has played the game several times, it's interesting having the ability to go with different characters.  The last time I played I choose all the powerhouses.  This time it's more the characters I like. 
The funny thing is sometimes I get tired of restarting, abandon the game and down the road pick it up and start all over from the beginning. Every time I do this my team changes a little bit. I have only beaten two Fire Emblem games but I still get hours of enjoyment from each one. Every time I play through it feels different enough I don't get tired of doing it thanks to the other units I choose.

But it does bother the OCD in me that wants to level up every character the first time through. 

It should be called CDO, because then the letters are in alphabetical order...AS THEY SHOULD BE! ;)
« Last Edit: November 16, 2009, 04:15:42 AM by Stratos »
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