Author Topic: Disney & Sony make up!! Spider-Man back in the MCU!!!.... For now.  (Read 28607 times)

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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Our collective nightmare came true.... Disney got greedy, Sony got bold
all of us suffer the consequences....

Feige and Holland no more  :'(

https://deadline.com/2019/08/kevin-feige-spider-man-franchise-exit-disney-sony-dispute-avengers-endgame-captain-america-winter-soldier-tom-rothman-bob-iger-1202672545/

hopefully they come back to the table to work this out and hopefully there was already a deal in place for Spidey3....

Venom 2, Morbius and anything else Sony does with Marvel characters will have to BOMB to get Sony to cave and agree to share the cost and profits. Or Disney will just have to flex it's piggy bank and buy Sony Pictures. LOL

Quote from: from article
Sources said there are two more Spider-Man films in the works that are meant to have director Jon Watts and Tom Holland front and center. Unless something dramatic happens, Feige won’t be the lead creative producer of those pictures.


There is a lot of webbing here, but it all comes down to money, and it’s easy to understand why both sides refused to give ground. Disney asked that future Spider-Man films be a 50/50 co-financing arrangement between the studios, and there were discussions that this might extend to other films in the Spider-Man universe. Sony turned that offer down flat, and I don’t believe they even came back to the table to figure out a compromise. Led by Tom Rothman and Tony Vinciquerra, Sony just simply didn’t want to share its biggest franchise. Sony proposed keeping the arrangement going under the current terms where Marvel receives in the range of 5% of first dollar gross, sources said. Disney refused.

Hopefully they reach a compromise before Spidey 3 would start production... or whatever his next planned appearance/cameo was.

25/75 Cost/profits split?
maybe Disney can slip a little clause in there to eventually just get the rights back.
I think this was just the start of an ugly negotiating process that will HOPEFULLY end with an agreement to bring Spidey back home where he belongs.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2019, 07:29:49 PM by BlackNMild2k1 »

Offline Adrock

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2019, 04:44:04 PM »
Prediction: Disney will overpay in the short-term just to not deal with Sony anymore.

Offline nickmitch

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2019, 05:43:12 PM »
So, from what I read, Disney made an offer and Sony declined because they wanted to keep the deal as-is?  Doesn't sound like they negotiated much.  I guess we'll see how much influence Feige has over the company as a whole if he can get a deal a done.  I'm with Adrock, however, in thinking Disney will just overpay, which is honestly fair, since Disney retains the merchandising rights.

I can understand where both are coming from.  Especially with Sony now having the "keys to the kingdom" with a Spider-Man template that works and a Venom spin-off that also worked.  The problem is, of course, that they could end up shooting themselves in the foot by making a Spider-Man movie without a lot of the characters in the last movie (which could lose the audiences) or worse, making a bunch of bad movies that lose money.
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Offline broodwars

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2019, 06:09:02 PM »
Reportedly, the previous deal was that Sony kept 95-100% of the box office revenue from the Spidey MCU films, while Disney got a similar split for the merchandising. Disney wanted to renegotiate the deal so they go 50% of the box office revenue, and Sony said "nah". And good on them for doing so.

Disney had no bargaining power for such a split at this point. Yeah, Endgame is the biggest movie of all time, not accounting for inflation. Well, guess what? All the characters people actually care about are either gone or on their way out...except Spider-Man. Being at your peak means everything that follows is all downhill from there.

Meanwhile, Sony's been on an upward trajectory with Spidey considering the critical success of Into the Spider-verse and the commercial success of Far From Home & Venom. Sony had all the power in that negotiation, and it's good to see Disney lose for once.

Now watch all the Spidey books get mysteriously cancelled from Marvel Comics after all the characters are sent to an alternate dimension or something.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2019, 06:22:25 PM by broodwars »
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2019, 07:13:36 PM »
Disney over reached probably expecting Sony to counter with something in the middle.
Sony instead reset the board back to the current status quo, got up and walked away....

I bet Disney will re-approach Sony and offer something more in the middle
to which hopefully Sony won't get up and walk away again, but instead counter with something close to halfway between that (15/85 split + milestone bonuses + production pay)

Lord Feige will pull a few strings behind the scenes and will make this happen quietly.... much like him getting James Gunn rehired.
We won't hear anything about it until we get that Spidey3 announcement at CC2021 for Phase 5

Offline BeautifulShy

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #5 on: August 20, 2019, 07:21:21 PM »
One other thing to consider is that Sony recently bought Insomiac Games who did the superb Spider-Man PS4 game so maybe Sony wants to have more sway in regards to the video game franchise with the rights to Spider-Man.
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Offline Adrock

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2019, 07:23:09 PM »
All the characters people actually care about are either gone or on their way out...except Spider-Man.
Yeah, I’m going to need you to show your work. Black Panther, for example, is the highest grossing solo superhero film.

Sony had no idea what the **** it was doing with Spider-Man before Marvel brought the character into the MCU. Into the Spider-Verse was excellent, but until Sony shows some consistency, it’s still the studio that had electric eels close a man’s tooth gap and give him the power to create underwear.

Sure, Sony can take it’s chances. Should it though? I still think it should and will sell high. No use spending the next five years fucking everything up again then having to sell low due to incompetence. Marvel won’t throw Sony another bone.

Offline broodwars

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2019, 07:39:03 PM »
All the characters people actually care about are either gone or on their way out...except Spider-Man.
Yeah, I’m going to need you to show your work. Black Panther, for example, is the highest grossing solo superhero film.

Assuming those box office results are real. Consider that we just had a story today where a whistleblower revealed that Disney's allegedly been inflating their parks & resorts revenue numbers for years.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/disney-whistleblower-told-sec-the-company-inflated-revenue-for-years-2019-08-19

I saw stories online of people seeing "sold out" empty theaters of Captain Marvel during its first week of release. Putting those stories together, I'd like to see Disney prove its ticket sales.

Also, both Black Panther & Captain Marvel were riding the coattails of the Infinity War Saga. I highly doubt that the next installments of those films will do anywhere near as well without people checking them out just to make sure they weren't missing crucial bits of information for the one plot thread the entire MCU focused on for 10 years.

Quote
Sony had no idea what the **** it was doing with Spider-Man before Marvel brought the character into the MCU. Into the Spider-Verse was excellent, but until Sony shows some consistency, it’s still the studio that had electric eels close a man’s tooth gap and give him the power to create underwear.

No disagreements here on that. Just saying, Sony has what Disney needs. They have the advantage in the negotiations right now considering where the Spider-Man IP is RIGHT NOW. Meanwhile, the MCU is both at its strongest & weakest, with everything depending on whether Disney can make people care about a universe now built around the C-list characters (and the Guardians).

Now, if the next round of Spidey-verse films tank, that will change the game once again and we'll probably see the same thing happen that led to Spidey being shoe-horned into the MCU in the 1st place.

In the meantime, I hope to see an actual Spider-Man film instead of Iron Man & His Amazing Friends.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2019, 07:40:48 PM by broodwars »
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Offline ShyGuy

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #8 on: August 20, 2019, 07:58:07 PM »
I'm tellin ya, Feige's days are numbered. What a huge loss for the MCU.

Offline Adrock

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #9 on: August 20, 2019, 08:19:59 PM »
Also, both Black Panther & Captain Marvel were riding the coattails of the Infinity War Saga.
Again, I'm going to need you to show your work. A lot of people skip the solo films and only watch the crossovers. Both Captain Marvel and especially Black Panther were milestones for marginalized groups. People showed up because both films were culturally relevant. There was someone on this very message board who didn't know "smile more" was street harassment women deal with every day. It was important for people to go out and support these movies. To reduce their success to "riding the coattails of the Infinity War Saga" is hella ignorant, man.
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Meanwhile, the MCU is both at its strongest & weakest, with everything depending on whether Disney can make people care about a universe now built around the C-list characters (and the Guardians).
Marvel laid the foundation of the MCU with C-list characters and the Hulk who was easily in the worst Phase 1 movie. No one cared about Iron Man before Robert Downey Jr. played him. You brought up the Guardians of the Galaxy who were on an even lower tier than the other non-Hulk Avengers.



Offline ShyGuy

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #12 on: August 20, 2019, 08:39:25 PM »
Who's broodwars?

Offline broodwars

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #13 on: August 20, 2019, 09:00:05 PM »
Who's broodwars?

There is no broodwars. Only Zuul.
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Offline nickmitch

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #14 on: August 20, 2019, 09:01:39 PM »
Also, both Black Panther & Captain Marvel were riding the coattails of the Infinity War Saga.
Again, I'm going to need you to show your work. A lot of people skip the solo films and only watch the crossovers. Both Captain Marvel and especially Black Panther were milestones for marginalized groups. People showed up because both films were culturally relevant. There was someone on this very message board who didn't know "smile more" was street harassment women deal with every day. It was important for people to go out and support these movies. To reduce their success to "riding the coattails of the Infinity War Saga" is hella ignorant, man.

Yeah, most of the people I know and others I socialize with online were excited to see a Black Panther movie.  These same people held Blade in high regard and were genuinely excited when BP was announced.  If you're in certain social media circles, you also saw tonnes of people dressed up to see the movie, and not just on opening weekend, either.

Quote
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Meanwhile, the MCU is both at its strongest & weakest, with everything depending on whether Disney can make people care about a universe now built around the C-list characters (and the Guardians).
Marvel laid the foundation of the MCU with C-list characters and the Hulk who was easily in the worst Phase 1 movie. No one cared about Iron Man before Robert Downey Jr. played him*. You brought up the Guardians of the Galaxy who were on an even lower tier than the other non-Hulk Avengers.


*Except for Ghostface Killah
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Offline ThePerm

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #15 on: August 20, 2019, 09:09:08 PM »
 Ugh Sony. If they can't work out any sort of agreement with Marvel I just won't watch the next movie. It'll be Ghostbusters 2016(I did end up watching it, and didn't hate it, but well after the box office period)
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Offline ThePerm

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #16 on: August 20, 2019, 09:32:32 PM »
Marvel should just release Deadpool 3 at the same time as the next spider-man movie. Tom Holland should be in it, but as a character named "Kid" who should be suffering from an Existential crisis.
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #17 on: August 20, 2019, 10:38:09 PM »
Hmmm..... I guess it was just Disney being Scrooge McFuckSony afterall....



Hopefully Feige can talk some sense into whoever was negotiating on the side of Disney, and get this **** done.
I want my Holland MCU Spidey 3 (can we finally get a good Spider-man trilogy!?) and I also want my Spidey cameo's with Deadpool and whoever else SM frequents in the comics.

I wonder what Sony countered with besides "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"

edit: well... I guess theirs two sides to every story



we need another SONY EMAIL LEAK to get to the truth... but let it also include the audio recordings for these negotiations.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2019, 10:44:45 PM by BlackNMild2k1 »

Offline pokepal148

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #18 on: August 20, 2019, 11:17:03 PM »
Nah, Disney email leak sounds much more juicy.

Offline ShyGuy

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #19 on: August 21, 2019, 09:55:45 AM »
So Spiderman has left the MCU? After the cliffhanger ending? Sony can't make Spiderman movies either?

Offline broodwars

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #20 on: August 21, 2019, 10:27:22 AM »
So Spiderman has left the MCU? After the cliffhanger ending? Sony can't make Spiderman movies either?

Sony can make as many Spider-Man films as they want. They could even continue from Far From Home if they wanted, since that was a Sony film. However, they would not be able to use the iconography, characters, or storylines from the Disney Marvel films.
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Offline Stratos

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #21 on: August 21, 2019, 02:19:42 PM »
This obviously ins't over, but until then I will not be spending any money on anything related to Sony if I can help it.
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Offline broodwars

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #22 on: August 21, 2019, 03:44:24 PM »
This obviously ins't over, but until then I will not be spending any money on anything related to Sony if I can help it.

Why not? Disney is the one in the wrong here. Sony & Disney had a mutually good thing going until Disney decided to act like the monopoly they are.
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Offline Stratos

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #23 on: August 21, 2019, 04:10:02 PM »
I'm not trying to justify Disney, but there certainly appears to be spin by Sony's side to make them sound more in the wrong here. I'm saying it isn't over because I have no doubt the dialogue will carry on eventually.
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Offline ThePerm

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Re: Disney & Sony Fighting results in MCU losing Spider-Man!!!
« Reply #24 on: August 21, 2019, 07:28:43 PM »
Imagine if we still had to worry about fucking Wand of Gamelon games from Panasonic.

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