Author Topic: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion  (Read 16205 times)

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Offline Jonnyboy117

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RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« on: October 16, 2011, 12:13:32 AM »
Please use this thread for discussion of the latest RetroActive poll selection, River City Ransom (NES). This is a beat-em-up/RPG hybrid with 2-player co-op, starring characters from the "Kunio-Kun" franchise that is currently celebrating its 25th anniversary in Japan. This game is available worldwide on Wii Virtual Console for about 500 points ($5.00 USD).


Note: Excerpts from posts in this thread may be read aloud on the Radio Free Nintendo podcast when we discuss the game!
THE LAMB IS WATCHING!

Offline Lithium

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2011, 04:49:39 AM »
just started playing now. Control and movement feel a bit floaty and slow but i'll keep playing, maybe i'll get used to it.

edit:
I ran into a great walkthough that i wish i saw before i finished this game
 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=goQlPC5wOic
« Last Edit: October 18, 2011, 05:27:58 AM by Lithium »

Offline lolmonade

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2011, 07:28:58 AM »
I hold your city captive & Ryan’s girlfriend hostage.  With my gangs of students & evil bosses, nobody can stop me now.  Meet my demands – or else!...P.S. Alex & Ryan if you interfere, you’ll be in for the fight of your lives!... SLICK

Offline Lithium

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2011, 11:45:28 AM »
I think I've gone as far as I can in this game. I went to the entrance to River city high but the gates wont open, so I checked online and apparently I missed some bosses, So I went to the locations of the bosses that I apparently missed but found nothing. So I trecked all the way back and the gates are still closed, after checking around (both on the internet and in game) for about an hour and a half I just gave up. Pretty sure I missed some obscure trigger in the game but I've lost patience to continue looking, at least for now anyways.

btw get the stone fist and dragon feet as quickly as you can, they're a godsend. You have to buy the moves at the bookstore, but don't throw away the books, because apparently Alex's memory is shot and without it he forgets his techniques. This means your item slots get progressively smaller the more techniques you learn.

also the warehouse is the most annoying part in the game so far. The jumping controls are so wonky :/
« Last Edit: October 17, 2011, 12:02:22 PM by Lithium »

Offline ejamer

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #4 on: October 17, 2011, 12:41:51 PM »
Personally I prefer to eat so that my stats increase - especially for weapons and throwing - rather than buy special moves that have to be carried around. Of course, I also spent the better part of the game using a chain to obliterate all foes. It's especially nice once you can throw weapons and kill enemies with a single hit from a distance. With bosses I could usually find two weapons and then time my throws to keep them on the ground and safely away from me until they were defeated.

Agree that jumping is wonky. Kind of enjoyable in a "ridiculously old-school" way though, and also really useful in some cases. A running leap can take you a long way out of (or into) danger


Who is playing this game co-op?  I recently played through solo, and am curious if there are any differences.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2011, 03:31:12 PM by ejamer »
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Offline lolmonade

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #5 on: October 17, 2011, 01:22:25 PM »
When I played Scott Pilgrim vs. The World, I read that it was influenced by River City Ransom, but I didn't realize how much had been lifted from this game. 
 
One of my favorite things about SPVTW was leveling up until my character was a beast and then being able to fly through the stages pummeling people like a dump truck with a rocket attached to it.  I'm hoping I'll see a noticeable difference after leveling up my character, because so far i've been on the receiving end of the beatdowns.

Offline Lithium

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #6 on: October 17, 2011, 03:04:11 PM »
One of my favorite things about SPVTW was leveling up until my character was a beast and then being able to fly through the stages pummeling people like a dump truck with a rocket attached to it.  I'm hoping I'll see a noticeable difference after leveling up my character, because so far i've been on the receiving end of the beatdowns.

Oh don't worry, you will. You don't level up by actually fighting enemies, but you use the money that they drop to buy items to up your stats. In true old school fashion they don't tell you anything about what the items do though, but thats what gamefaqs is for if you'd rather just know instead of finding out.

« Last Edit: October 17, 2011, 03:16:37 PM by Lithium »

Offline lolmonade

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #7 on: October 17, 2011, 03:18:44 PM »
One of my favorite things about SPVTW was leveling up until my character was a beast and then being able to fly through the stages pummeling people like a dump truck with a rocket attached to it.  I'm hoping I'll see a noticeable difference after leveling up my character, because so far i've been on the receiving end of the beatdowns.

Oh don't worry, you will. You don't level up by actually fighting enemies, but you use the money that they drop to buy items to up your stats. In true old school fashion they don't tell you anything about what the items do though, but thats what gamefaqs is for if you'd rather just know instead of finding out.



Yeah, that's exactly how scott pilgrim does it, not giving any info on what the items do and all.  I look forward to roflstomping everything once I eat all the foodz.

Offline Lithium

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #8 on: October 17, 2011, 04:59:03 PM »
Well this game was pretty short. I had troubles with the controls at first but once you level up and gain a few techniques it isn't that bad (but I still want to throttle the coder responsible for the jumping controls). Needless to say i figured out what my problem was with the river city high gate. You needed to backtrack way back to find an easily missed boss, then and only then will subsequent bosses appear (you need to find/beat all the bosses to trigger the gate to open). Usually the bosses tell you where the next boss is but without a map its pretty pointless. One of the bosses even neglects to mention that before the boss he tells you about will show up you have to beat another boss before.  I'm not sure how you're supposed to know that but whatever...This is an old school game after all. BTW for some bosses you have to beat every enemy in the area before they will appear; and don't throw Thor into the pit or else it doesn't count for some reason.

the writing in this game is pretty humorous, lolmonade's first post is basically the very first thing you read in the game and is a pretty good indication of how silly it is. (I think its intentional, but with games from this era you never know) This game is short, and most of your time will be grinding and general difficulty hurdles but it was pretty fun, warts and all.

I was hoping for a hilarious engrish phrase at the end of the credits roll but all I got was a lousy "the end"
« Last Edit: October 17, 2011, 05:27:56 PM by Lithium »

Offline Ceric

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #9 on: October 17, 2011, 05:10:20 PM »
There's Warts?

Need a Personal NonCitizen-Magical-Elf-Boy-Child-Game-Abused-King-Kratos-Play-Thing Crimm Unmaker-of-Worlds-Hunter-Of-Boxes
so, I don't have to edit as Much.

Offline Da Jarvis

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #10 on: October 18, 2011, 03:27:43 AM »
Just downloaded the game today and put about 3 hours into it... and I have kind of a mixed bag about it. At first, I found the game to be pretty simple, as all you really need to do on the novice setting is just spam the Kick Button until people die, but then I got to the bosses... to say it simply, they kicked my ass, and I have begun to notice some problems I have with the game. First of, the game never goes into detail about any of it's complexitys like what items do, how to equip items, and most importantly, there is never really any set direction to go. Granted, it's an NES game and a lot of games at the time had a whole exploration aspect to them (Zelda and Metroid), but I feel River City Ransom doesn't do it as well as though games. On top of that, when you die, you have to fight the bosses you beat ALL OVER AGAIN! Why? Could you imagine if Zelda or Metroid made you refight the bosses when you died? What else is really depressing is when you die for the first time, you think the game has a checkpoint system, but no... it just takes away half you cash and resets all the bosses. There are a couple little things that bother me, like how you can damage yourself by running into walls or running off cliffs that are right at the beggining of screen, and hurting yourself because items bounce off walls and getting gang raped by thugs who surround you.


To say the least, it hasn't really aged all that way well, but most of my complaints are common with a lot of NES games at the time. However, my biggest complaint about the game is just how grind heavy the game is (or so at first). Since the game doesn't tell you what items do and it just tells you how you need to get stronger, you are forced into farming for cash on easy enemys so you can aquire power-ups that don't always give you what you need, which then has you farming agian to buy something different and when you find that magic item, you then need more money so you can buy more of them, so you grind some more... you see where I am going? This is also my exact complaint with Earthbound, because both games have a create combat systems and are fun to play, but the grinding just slows down the pacing WAY TO MUCH! It's just really anyoying and granted, the combat is a lot of fun, but that is to much, and if you die on a boss, guess what? You need to beat the bosses again, so you grind some more to get ready to beat that bosses. I feel they put the whole RPG element in there mainly because they wanted something to suck up time.


A while back, I once heard a wise man discuss the major differences and flaws between Castalvania 1 and Castalvania 2: Simon's Quest (Which also has a crap tone of grinding) and he as well hated the grinding in the game. His responce was the fallowing, "Let me ask something? What is the difference between: a) killing a bunch of zombies to collect a bunch of hearts, collecting the hearts out of them so you can buy an item to get to another part of the game and b) playing a game where you kill zombies that try to stop you from reaching the end of the game? Answer: 4 HOURS!!!". I feel the same way with this game. They force you to grind so you can basically gauntlet through the rest of the game, when they could of just avoided that and put more work into creating memorable and unique levels and focus more on the smooth combat and better boss fights, instead of making you take ages to get you character up so you can attempt to take on the rest of hte game. To be honest, the game demands a lot from you and the reward isn't that great.


After about 2 and 1/2 hours of grinding and failing at the bosses (which are pretty cheap in some case), I jumped on youtube and found a really helpful game guide and after playing for another 30 minutes, ended up finding the game to be a lot more enjoyable. There are two ways to make this game a lot shorter and take out all of or some of the grinding: 1) Grind a bit in the beggining so you can buy the Dragon Feet (BEST ITEM IN THE GAME) and make your kick EVEN MORE AMAZING and just race through the rest of the game buying some power-ups along the way (takes about 20-30 minutes), or 2) Put in a code that gives you all items and max stats and beat the game in under 12 minutes. The second one is cheating, yes, but the game is so much better when you don't have to worry about leveling up your character (which is also pretty flawed as you level up off random item effects), and you only need to buy health and heal items. Personally, I think this game caters a lot more to that play style rather then making you take ages to do what you want.


Overal, despite it's flaws, there is a pretty solid brawler under the hood. The combat is pretty fun and can be deep once you aquire the other items, and the game had a lot of ground breaking ideas for it's time (A pretty solid game world and a pretty big focus on exploration), but it just doesn't bring it all together properally. It's a nice try, but other games later did this much better.


Sorry for the novel, but I had quite a bit to say about the game xD.
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Offline Lithium

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #11 on: October 18, 2011, 04:49:00 AM »
     ....There are two ways to make this game a lot shorter and take out all of or some of the grinding: 1) Grind a bit in the beggining so you can buy the Dragon Feet (BEST ITEM IN THE GAME) and make your kick EVEN MORE AMAZING and just race through the rest of the game buying some power-ups along the way (takes about 20-30 minutes), or 2) Put in a code that gives you all items and max stats and beat the game in under 12 minutes. The second one is cheating, yes, but the game is so much better when you don't have to worry about leveling up your character.

That's pretty much what i did because I got tired of grinding (around the time where i was running around looking for the bosses) So i just entered a password cheat. I completely agree with you on that point, It ain't fun. (and why i dislike a lot of Jrpgs) However its hard for me to knock it for being a product of it's time especially when as you said it's pretty progressive for a brawler from this era.

$999.99 dollars*
C K X I E e S f q s X
 J W A W k U F D W G M
 S H K L b S O N M B A

If you want to cheat while still being within the parameters of the game this is probably the way to do it. Everything is the same and allows you to discover/experiment with items but it just saves you a **** ton of time.

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t1izvpdOZnZ JxNkJp7Cpub XMPQgXErSMF
Just in case you run into the same problem I did this will save you a lot of grief.

*found a password generator online for this game
http://ensomnya.net/projects/rcr_password/rcrpassgen.html
« Last Edit: October 18, 2011, 05:49:04 AM by Lithium »

Offline Da Jarvis

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2011, 01:58:23 PM »
     ....There are two ways to make this game a lot shorter and take out all of or some of the grinding: 1) Grind a bit in the beggining so you can buy the Dragon Feet (BEST ITEM IN THE GAME) and make your kick EVEN MORE AMAZING and just race through the rest of the game buying some power-ups along the way (takes about 20-30 minutes), or 2) Put in a code that gives you all items and max stats and beat the game in under 12 minutes. The second one is cheating, yes, but the game is so much better when you don't have to worry about leveling up your character.

That's pretty much what i did because I got tired of grinding (around the time where i was running around looking for the bosses) So i just entered a password cheat. I completely agree with you on that point, It ain't fun. (and why i dislike a lot of Jrpgs) However its hard for me to knock it for being a product of it's time especially when as you said it's pretty progressive for a brawler from this era.



It's funny you say that actually, as I tend to like JRPGs and actually find you don't have to grind that much for some of them. I mean, I remeber playing games like Chrono Trigger, Final Fantasy X, Pokemon, and Legend of Dragoon and never really having to worry about grinding all that much, and I usually love JRPGs. However, Games like Earthbound that are only difficult because the boss and enemeys are that much higher level then you is just really lame. I feel a game should be difficult because you haven't figured out the trick to how you beat the boss, and that's what a boss should be. It should be a challenging opponent that is differenent the common grunts or elites (No Halo Pun Intended) and should be fun, difficult, and rewarding to play and beat. River City Ransom just doesn't do that at all. The bosses are just stronger dudes that do more damage and are more aggressive, and the only real way to beat them is to level up and grind... it's just really lame to be honest.


Also, IDK if you have it, but did you use the Max Stats code as well?
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Offline Lithium

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2011, 02:24:44 PM »
It [bosses] should be a challenging opponent that is differenent the common grunts or elites (No Halo Pun Intended) and should be fun, difficult, and rewarding to play and beat. River City Ransom just doesn't do that at all. The bosses are just stronger dudes that do more damage and are more aggressive, and the only real way to beat them is to level up and grind... it's just really lame to be honest.


Also, IDK if you have it, but did you use the Max Stats code as well?

Yeah that's pretty much how i feel about grinding as well (and the game's bosses). a lot of the JPRGS i like tend to be outliers like Chrono trigger and the (Paper) mario rpgs because they stray from the forumla (but thats another discusion for another time)

also, i only used the money cheat in my post basically to experience everything in the game the same way but just accelerate the experience. but I wish i found the river city gate cheat sooner.

Offline Enner

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #14 on: October 18, 2011, 02:26:38 PM »
Oh, I never thought of using codes.

I beat the game by grinding cash until I got all the special moves. Glee was obtained when I was able to pick up a trash can and swing it like the Fist of the North Star. I have played a good chunk of the game cooperatively but we got stuck at the part where you were supposed to back track. I don't think we would've gone far since we kept losing our money and weren't able to buy the special moves and statistic upgrades. Hey, losing your currency that is essentially your experience parts every time you are defeated? Demon's Souls and Dark Souls was influenced by River City Ransom.

The statistics growth, equipment upgrades, and skill unlocks of River City Ransom was ahead of its time for beat'em ups. When you look at games today that succeed the genre (Devil May Cry, Bayonetta, God of War, Castle Crashers, Scott Pilgrim vs The World: The Game, Dynasty Warriors) you will be hard pressed to find a game that doesn't have at least one of the player character growth systems that River City Ransom has.

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #15 on: October 18, 2011, 10:01:49 PM »
I was thinking about getting this game, but the comments here about the excessive grinding are a real turnoff. I might still try it out if I come across a deal for it sometime soon.

Offline Enner

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #16 on: October 18, 2011, 11:15:34 PM »
I was thinking about getting this game, but the comments here about the excessive grinding are a real turnoff. I might still try it out if I come across a deal for it sometime soon.

Even though I grinded money, I was still able to beat the game by myself in about 2-3 hours. It's a short game even when you spend the time to make your character really mighty. For US$5, it's not too bad for a piece of beat'em up history.

Offline Da Jarvis

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #17 on: October 19, 2011, 12:29:31 AM »
It [bosses] should be a challenging opponent that is differenent the common grunts or elites (No Halo Pun Intended) and should be fun, difficult, and rewarding to play and beat. River City Ransom just doesn't do that at all. The bosses are just stronger dudes that do more damage and are more aggressive, and the only real way to beat them is to level up and grind... it's just really lame to be honest.


Also, IDK if you have it, but did you use the Max Stats code as well?

Yeah that's pretty much how i feel about grinding as well (and the game's bosses). a lot of the JPRGS i like tend to be outliers like Chrono trigger and the (Paper) mario rpgs because they stray from the forumla (but thats another discusion for another time)

also, i only used the money cheat in my post basically to experience everything in the game the same way but just accelerate the experience. but I wish i found the river city gate cheat sooner.


Oh, I totally forgot about Paper Mario, which is also a very good game :). I have only played The Thousand Year Door (I have also played Super Mario RPG, but that really doesn't count I guess xD), but I loved that game and was a reason for me to keep my gamecube other then Wind Waker and Melee xD.


I can see your point, but I just personally found it easier to just not worry about buying stat increases and found it a waste of my time to try and learn the faulty leveling up system.
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Offline Da Jarvis

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #18 on: October 19, 2011, 12:44:41 AM »
I beat the game by grinding cash until I got all the special moves. Glee was obtained when I was able to pick up a trash can and swing it like the Fist of the North Star. I have played a good chunk of the game cooperatively but we got stuck at the part where you were supposed to back track. I don't think we would've gone far since we kept losing our money and weren't able to buy the special moves and statistic upgrades. Hey, losing your currency that is essentially your experience parts every time you are defeated? Demon's Souls and Dark Souls was influenced by River City Ransom.

The statistics growth, equipment upgrades, and skill unlocks of River City Ransom was ahead of its time for beat'em ups. When you look at games today that succeed the genre (Devil May Cry, Bayonetta, God of War, Castle Crashers, Scott Pilgrim vs The World: The Game, Dynasty Warriors) you will be hard pressed to find a game that doesn't have at least one of the player character growth systems that River City Ransom has.


Yeah, I agree that RCR was way ahead of it's time, but I think even back then, the execution of the mechanics just aren't very good.
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Offline lolmonade

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #19 on: October 20, 2011, 08:49:21 PM »
So far, my favorite part of the game is some of the silly faces the characters get when they get hit.



I enjoy the gameplay, and buying items have greatly improved my ability to mow over baddies, but more than anything progress in this game comes down to angles and timing.  If an enemy gets in one shot on you, expect to get hit 3-6 times and lose a quarter of your health before all is said and done.  Reminds me a lot of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles II: The Arcade Game on NES in that respect.

Jumping back to a game like this makes you appreciate things like dedicated buttons for jumping, save points, and being able to run diagonally in a fighting game.  I don't necessarily find the game difficult.  I just think the difficulty curve is a horizontal line that starts higher than most games, but doesn't really increase over time, where as most games now will start easy and graduate the difficulty as you progress.

Offline leahsdad

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #20 on: October 23, 2011, 06:24:21 AM »
I've put about an hour into the game so far, but one of things that really struck me as I began to understand the level up system and its effect on the combat was how much the modern metroidvania's have lifted from this game.  You definitely notice when you're in an area where the street gangs are way too tough for you, as they start blocking everything you throw at them, with the exception of the things that you literally throw at them. 

But I love how food works into the health and level system.  It seems so Japanese (which makes sense, obviously).  The most recent game I can think of that incorporated this was Muramasa, which while boring still hooked me with its addictive but repetitive gameplay.  So I played that game to completion, and food (and cooking) was a huge part of the health/magic system.
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Offline leahsdad

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #21 on: October 23, 2011, 08:57:46 AM »
Okay, I broke down and looked up a gamefaq, solely because of the stores and the food.  If I was younger, I would be playing with a notepad, trying all the different kinds of foods and items, writing down how each of them affected my stats.  I remember back in the day when we were drawing our own maps while playing games.  Seriously.  Yup, I'm Linderman old!

But I've got 2 kids, very limited time for gaming, and I just don't have the patience, so I looked up a faq with all the stores, what they sell, and how they affect stats.  Jeez, did that change the game for me.  Now I'm  pumping my stats like crazy (Love those Honey Buns!) and I've got Stone Hands and Dragon Feet. 

Oh, and the young'uns on these forums might be fooled into thinking that "60 cents a gang member?  Damn, that must have been a lot of money back in the 80's when this game came out."  Uh, no.  It wasn't.  60 cents couldn't even buy a comic book when this game came out.  And this game probably cost $50.   When you think about that, games are ridiculously cheap now, considering that inflation has far outpaced the cost of a single game.
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Offline Lithium

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #22 on: October 23, 2011, 01:57:26 PM »
Oh, and the young'uns on these forums might be fooled into thinking that "60 cents a gang member?  Damn, that must have been a lot of money back in the 80's when this game came out."  Uh, no.  It wasn't.  60 cents couldn't even buy a comic book when this game came out.  And this game probably cost $50.   When you think about that, games are ridiculously cheap now, considering that inflation has far outpaced the cost of a single game.

even more amazing considering the sales, i got metroid other m for $10 NEW and some iphone games match the depth of some $50 NES games back then
« Last Edit: October 23, 2011, 02:05:39 PM by Lithium »

Offline Shaymin

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #23 on: October 26, 2011, 10:11:10 PM »
Just wrapped it up tonight - basic enough 8-bit ending, but since the storyline's one screen at the start I can forgive it.

I had a lot of fun playing this game in multiplayer when I rented it (repeatedly) in my younger days, but never got a chance to try it this time so I don't recall if it had friendly fire. Then again, I killed myself at least twice running, slipping on the Wii controls and taking out my last bit of health hitting a wall... so it wouldn't have done me any more harm.

I did find that I had to grind constantly for cash until I sucked it up and used a password generator, because it's very easy to die in this game which makes grinding cash a pain. (If it's not the accidental suicide, it's the Elite Mooks bashing me about the head and neck with dustbins. F**k those guys.)

Still, it's one of the best brawlers on the NES, up there with Double Dragon 2, and you haven't lived until you managed to one-shot a boss with Acro Circus.
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Offline Ceric

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Re: RFN RetroActive #20 - River City Ransom - Official Discussion
« Reply #24 on: October 27, 2011, 05:15:07 PM »
In today's prices you would be paying $1.10 per gang member.  So what a candy bar.
If you bought this game for $50 in 1989 when it was released in Japan you would have bought what is the equivalent today of a $91.49 game.
Need a Personal NonCitizen-Magical-Elf-Boy-Child-Game-Abused-King-Kratos-Play-Thing Crimm Unmaker-of-Worlds-Hunter-Of-Boxes
so, I don't have to edit as Much.