Author Topic: Game Journalism  (Read 127404 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline NinGurl69 *huggles

  • HI I'M CRAZY
  • Score: 28
    • View Profile
    • Six Sided Video
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #200 on: February 07, 2010, 12:08:54 AM »
Actually, looking over the output from Square-Enix and Capcom, they don't come off all that badly (or to put it more precisely "they come off better than everyone else in this topic").  As for Square-Enix, I don't see any "bad" games in there.  I've played both Dragon Quest Swords and Chocobo's Mystery Dungeon, and they're both good games.  I've never played Echoes of Time or Crystal Bearers, but they both reviewed at least decently from what I remember.

The games, by themselves, not bad.  But also consider how the publisher behaved; how are they treating the projects and the products?

DQ Swords -- S-E borrowed a Nintendo developer to make it (was the project not good enough for their own teams?)
Chocobo -- nothing wrong here, it just exists
Echoes of Time -- the ugly side of connectivity:  it's a DS game, but on a disc.  Who's it REALLY for?  Wii gamers or DS gamers?  Who are they trying to convince to buy it, and are they trying?
The Crystal Bears -- Decent game (i'll vouch for it), but like Silent Hill, it's a victim of scheduling and marketing SABOTAGE.  What happened to the marketing push?  Is it just another title quietly sent to the shelf that the publisher doesn't believe in?

And moving from one title to the latter, how well is S-E's [Wii] brand strength holding up by the time it gets to Crystal Bearers?

Things to think about.  The fact they've only published 4 disc games total, despite their age/history and prestige, also makes them an oddity worth mentioning.



~ Square-Enix ~

1.  An on-rails spinoff NINTENDO MADE FOR THEM

ummm... what?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragon_Quest_Swords

DQS was co-developed by Genius Sonority and 8ing.  Genius Sonority is a company founded by Nintendo to develop Pokemon titles; its major shareholders include Nintendo and The Pokemon Company.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2010, 12:12:38 AM by NinGurl69 *huggles »
:: Six Sided Video .com ~ Pietriots.com ::
PRO IS SERIOUS. GET SERIOUS.

Offline Mop it up

  • And I've gotta say...
  • Score: 125
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #201 on: February 07, 2010, 12:11:53 AM »
The seal is no longer a "Seal of Quality" - merely the "Official Nintendo Seal".  As you said, it means the same thing either way.
I forgot that they changed it, probably because of the liability reasons of having a seal of quality that isn't actually based on quality.

Offline that Baby guy

  • He's a real Ei-Ei-Poo!
  • Score: 379
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #202 on: February 07, 2010, 12:13:00 AM »
Let's not forget, Chocobo's Dungeon loses some of the depth included in a previous iteration, removing 2-player co-op, and utilizing a more generic dungeon system.  Their support has been lacking.  With Square-Enix, I would have at least expected some ports of some PS2 titles with Wii-Remote controls shoe-horned in, as well as sequels announced when those titles would have likely sold well.

Offline NinGurl69 *huggles

  • HI I'M CRAZY
  • Score: 28
    • View Profile
    • Six Sided Video
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #203 on: February 07, 2010, 12:20:47 AM »
I'm done with this wall.  So long, everyone.
:: Six Sided Video .com ~ Pietriots.com ::
PRO IS SERIOUS. GET SERIOUS.

Offline broodwars

  • Hunting for a Pineapple Salad
  • Score: -1011
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #204 on: February 07, 2010, 12:30:44 AM »
Things to think about.  The fact they've only published 4 disc games total, despite their age/history and prestige, also makes them an oddity worth mentioning.

With the exception of the handhelds, though, Square-Enix hasn't had a huge presence on any platform this generation so the output seems pretty typical of them.  Sure, they have big projects in development on the HD consoles still (The other two Final Fantasy XIII games for example, and probably a Kingdom Hearts game somewhere down the road) and Dragon Quest X on the Wii, but for the most part they've been pretty conservative and quiet lately.
There was a Signature here. It's gone now.

Offline Stratos

  • Stale lazy meme pirate
  • Score: 70
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #205 on: February 07, 2010, 12:31:49 AM »
You can't leave The Wall. It never lets it's victims go.

Well, Ogre Battle 64 has been rated in both PAL and NA regions so maybe when that comes out and if it sells well we will see a new one on Wii?

One can only hope, and if so we'd better see one in the style of OB64.  None of that "Tactics" BS, thank you very much.

The OB64 control system would work amazingly well with the Wii's IR input.
My Game Collection
NNID: Chronocast
Switch: SW-6786-5514-9978
3DS Friend Code: 0447-5723-6467
XBL Gamertag: Chronocast

Offline ShyGuy

  • Fight Me!
  • *
  • Score: -9660
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #206 on: February 07, 2010, 12:34:24 AM »
This is an epic that will stand along side the outstanding walls of history. The Great Wall of China. The Berlin Wall. The Wailing Wall. and Now, the 3rd Party Wall of Shame. GAZE IN WONDER

Offline Stratos

  • Stale lazy meme pirate
  • Score: 70
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #207 on: February 07, 2010, 12:38:51 AM »
I gaze in horror and shame that during my time a great travesty occurred and I did nothing to try and stop it. Doing nothing is just as bad as supporting the growing beast.
My Game Collection
NNID: Chronocast
Switch: SW-6786-5514-9978
3DS Friend Code: 0447-5723-6467
XBL Gamertag: Chronocast

Offline broodwars

  • Hunting for a Pineapple Salad
  • Score: -1011
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #208 on: February 07, 2010, 12:44:11 AM »
I gaze in horror and shame that during my time a great travesty occurred and I did nothing to try and stop it. Doing nothing is just as bad as supporting the growing beast.

Well, I can certainly say I did my part to stop it: I largely ignored the 3rd parties and only bought the games I truly thought could be worthwhile (with only Madworld and The Conduit standing as games I really wish I hadn't bought).
There was a Signature here. It's gone now.

Offline Mop it up

  • And I've gotta say...
  • Score: 125
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #209 on: February 07, 2010, 12:54:55 AM »
Let's see...

-Sega-
It doesn't look like Sega's support is bad at a glance, but, well, their titles haven't seemed to review well. Still, at least they made an attempt...
I own six of these which are the two House of the Dead games, MadWorld, The Conduit, Sonic and the Secret Rings, and Mario and Sonic at the Olympic Games.
I'm interested in trying the other Sonic games, Samba De Amigo, and Nights, and am definitely getting Mario and Sonic at the Winter Olympics at some point.

-Konami-
What's Deca Sports doing there? I thought that was Hudson.
I own just one of those, Elebits, which I really enjoyed. I'm interesting in trying Dewey's Adventure and Silent Hill, and that's about it.

-Take Two-
I have none of these, and the only one which I want to try is Bully. I played Carnival Games and liked it, but since my friend has it I feel no need to buy it myself.

-Namco-
I have none of these either, but want to try a few. I guess Nintendo published Mario Super Sluggers and not Namco?

Offline King of Twitch

  • twitch.tv/zapr2k i live for this
  • Score: 141
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #210 on: February 07, 2010, 12:59:04 AM »
I gaze in horror and shame that during my time a great travesty occurred and I did nothing to try and stop it. Doing nothing is just as bad as supporting the growing beast.

Customers shouldn't have to. What happened to those people that used to interview other people, report the news, or ask a lot of questions stuff?
"I deem his stream to be supreme and highly esteem his Fortnite team!" - The Doritos Pope and his Mountain Dew Crew.

Offline Deguello

  • Cards makes me ill.
  • Score: 3
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #211 on: February 07, 2010, 02:01:49 AM »
This is a great testament that will live on through the ages.

What's funny to note about the "better" 3rd parties on the list, like Sega and Capcom, is that they still dipped into shovelware/casual territory at least once, and had bad sales and poor reviews to show for it.  Namco, instead of localizing quality games, decided to make a Food Network game that bombs.

And even Capcom falls into the awful game trap of making a game based of a Television Show nobody watched and a game about pets (Neo-pets, that is.  Thankfully no "Z").  They look completely incompetent.
It's time you saw the future while you still have human eyes.

... and those eyes see a 3DS system code : 2750-1598-3807

Offline Urkel

  • Reggie Fart-Aime
  • Score: 3
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #212 on: February 07, 2010, 02:05:21 AM »
What happened to those people that used to interview other people, report the news, or ask a lot of questions stuff?

They don't believe there's anything to be questioned. They bought the official 3rd party excuses hook, line, and sinker.
"ROFS? Rolling on the floor... starving?"- Phoenix Wright

Offline Deguello

  • Cards makes me ill.
  • Score: 3
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #213 on: February 07, 2010, 02:30:28 AM »
Yeah it's internalizing the messages of your abusers.  You see this a lot in bullied kids and rape victims.  Instead of thinking about the actual problem, being bullied/raped and the perpetrators involved, they begin to question themselves and adapt their behavior so as to appease the bullies.  It's an attitude supported by bullies because their targets will take all of the blame, the solution rests on their victim, and they do not have to accept any effort made by the victim.

Or, case in point, long editorials about Wii gamers and their habits, who they are, what they are, their behavior, what they should be doing, buying, etc. instead of even casting one critical eye at the third parties who are the ones exhibiting the bad behavior.  That's why they pull that sour-grapes attitude when people just stop buying their garbage.  As long as they can keep the focus on the Wii gamers, nobody has to look at their shoddy libraries.

And its pretty stunning how tasteful the Wii audience is.  For all this talk of shovelware selling on the Wii, there really isn't any evidence of it beyond a few titles from the naive years of 2007.  Apparently they aren't as stupid as the third parties or detractors thought, and they have made the best games the best sellers by their choices.  They should really be commended, but instead they are reviled for not being easy marks.  More's the pity.
It's time you saw the future while you still have human eyes.

... and those eyes see a 3DS system code : 2750-1598-3807

Offline KDR_11k

  • boring person
  • Score: 28
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #214 on: February 07, 2010, 03:14:50 AM »
I'm done with this wall.  So long, everyone.

Really? I've seen tons of shovelware that didn't show up, did you forget some publishers or just ignore them?

-Konami-
What's Deca Sports doing there? I thought that was Hudson.

Konami owns Hudson, I guess they publish their games too. Though looking at Amazon I see a few Hudson-Konami titles missing from the wall (Hard Working People, Kororinpa). Games like LittleKing's Story also seem unaccounted for.

Here in Germany we have Koch Mediawho localize many games from other companies but also seem to have things that are not listed on the wall.

Offline BlackNMild2k1

  • Animal Crossing Hustler
  • Score: 409
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #215 on: February 07, 2010, 03:21:55 AM »
I thing Pro just really needs a break from the brick laying.

But there is still lots of material left out there for the wall.
I don't see why someone else can't put a little effort into putting up a company they think is deserving.

Offline Deguello

  • Cards makes me ill.
  • Score: 3
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #216 on: February 07, 2010, 05:07:07 AM »
Quote
Really? I've seen tons of shovelware that didn't show up, did you forget some publishers or just ignore them?

I think Pro's point is not to catalog the entire Wii library but merely to focus on the big players who have the capacity to make better games and choose not to.  We're talking about the people with the infrastructure to get considerable product to retail.  Sure, he had Zoo publishing, but he purposefully sought out a shovelware company to show that this is what the major players look like.  I'm sure companies like Conspiracy Entertainment and D3Publisher also have some horrible games, but they aren't the ones who pledged to make better Wii games or pretend they know the Wii audience,  Like you said, can't blame a dog for licking its balls, right?  They also don't blame Nintendo for anything.

I also don't think he's very concerned with Eastern Shovelware because we're more likely to see Western shovelware and are less likely to stock Eastern shovelware like D3 Publisher and such.  Also, one developer and publisher is totally off the hook.  Marvelous, because their games are actually very good and decent.  (No more Heroes, Rune Factory, Muramasa, Arc Rise Fantasia, etc.  This is good effort, period.)  If anything, they actually would have a legitimate complaint against the Wii for their games underperforming.  But even so, only recently did they turn their sights to better game development, as before the DS they were in the same boat as THQ, where they had massive piles of uninteresting games save for one series that stood out (Harvest Moon.)  It takes time to give yourself a new image.  Over time and through consistency, good word-of-mouth spreads, but you can't pull up stakes after the first disappointment.  That's what that Conan O' Briend kerfuffle was all about.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2010, 06:24:55 AM by Deguello »
It's time you saw the future while you still have human eyes.

... and those eyes see a 3DS system code : 2750-1598-3807

Offline King of Twitch

  • twitch.tv/zapr2k i live for this
  • Score: 141
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #217 on: February 07, 2010, 03:57:47 PM »
What happened to those people that used to interview other people, report the news, or ask a lot of questions stuff?

They don't believe there's anything to be questioned. They bought the official 3rd party excuses hook, line, and sinker.

Then what's left? Writing a Petition/Notice of Third Party Probation and going viral?
"I deem his stream to be supreme and highly esteem his Fortnite team!" - The Doritos Pope and his Mountain Dew Crew.

Offline Kairon

  • T_T
  • NWR Staff Pro
  • Score: 48
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #218 on: February 08, 2010, 01:42:23 AM »
I love how we have an entire thread devoted to Kairon's porn stash.

Maybe you can help it keep going. Go grab a random Wii game from his collection and tell us who it is made by, and then we can add that company to the Wall of Shame too.

Jest all you want, but I'm PROUD of my Wii gaming stash, and each game was purchased with direct intent to own it. I haven't counted recently, but I may own more than 60 Wii games, most of them third-party, and maybe less than five of which I will admit to entertaining some regret at buying. (Though i will admit surprise that I've become part and parcel to the hardcore gamer stereotype of buying so many games that I can't find the time to play them all.)
Carmine Red, Associate Editor

A glooming peace this morning with it brings;
The sun, for sorrow, will not show his head:
Go hence, to have more talk of these sad things;
Some shall be pardon'd, and some punished:
For never was a story of more woe
Than this of Sega and her Mashiro.

Offline Stratos

  • Stale lazy meme pirate
  • Score: 70
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #219 on: February 08, 2010, 04:17:50 AM »
I know what you mean, Kairon. I have a number of games I have bought and not played, some are even still sealed! I've yet to try Muramasa and Crystal Bearers among other games. And I keep buying more. I even have WiiWare and VC games I've yet to play even once and a good deal have only been played a single time!...  :-\ ???

I think part of it is my desire to support good 3rd party games and want to keep seeing them come to Wii. One of these days I will find time to play them all and I hope I don't finish them all only to discover no more were made. It's also why I tend to prioritize non-Nintendo purchases since I know that the shelf life of most Nintendo games is much longer than others.
My Game Collection
NNID: Chronocast
Switch: SW-6786-5514-9978
3DS Friend Code: 0447-5723-6467
XBL Gamertag: Chronocast

Offline Pale

  • Staff Layton Hat Thief
  • Score: 4
    • View Profile
    • PaleHour
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #220 on: February 08, 2010, 09:20:07 AM »
I didn't read this thread except for the first sentence that called me out.

For the record, I wasn't claiming that there wasn't enough negativity on these boards.  What I was claiming was that there are too many damn threads that discuss how great/not great the Wii platform is in the most general sense. This is the kind of garbage that is tired in my opinion as it's been discussed to death. I don't care anymore.

So this thread fails too. Keep trying.
:: I was an active staffer forever ago, or was it yesterday. Time is an anomaly. Father of two boys.
---------------------
:: Grouvee :: Instagram

Offline Pale

  • Staff Layton Hat Thief
  • Score: 4
    • View Profile
    • PaleHour
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #221 on: February 08, 2010, 09:21:39 AM »
Also, I'm officially voiding the decision to make this a sticky.
:: I was an active staffer forever ago, or was it yesterday. Time is an anomaly. Father of two boys.
---------------------
:: Grouvee :: Instagram

Offline SixthAngel

  • Score: 18
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #222 on: February 08, 2010, 12:55:08 PM »
I didn't even realize this thread was here until you unstickied it.  I had only come here from links in other threads.  My mind just automatically blocks out all stickies on message boards because they all invariably say rules or other boring crap.
I suggest you read more than the first sentence next time before you call a thread fail though.

I don't think Sega's list is so bad.  I'm glad they ported their big light gun games because they are good and the only ones that actually let me use no cursor.  Mad World and The Conduit are pretty good too.  The rest is essentially Sonic games.

I notice a a trend throughout the list.  Many of these games seem to be simple advertisements with no attempt to actually make a game people buy.  Coldstone, M&Ms, a ridculous number of car brand games, all the tv shows that don't fit into a videogame format in the slightest.  Burger Kings obvious ad games were less obvious and probably better than these ads.  I understand Avatar and SpongeBob but Hell's Kitchen?  Really?

A few questions.  Why is there a Drawn to Life game on the Wii?  It was designed to be a drawing game on a system with stylus.  Why do 3rd parties think the word "party" helps sell their game?  It is generally used on minigame collections but they even use it when the first one did well.  I thought the one game was called Bash Party until I recognized the Boom Blox animals.  If I see party I pass it buy (even Mario Party).

I get the feeling a lot of this crap is their to purposefully hurt other 3rd parties.  One of the big reaons for releasing so much crap is that they want to choke out the competition from starting anything  big on the system.  Once the big companies decided not to really go into the Wii they decided to go with quick and easy crap that could make some money if they get lucky and would immediately bury any little guy making a game under a pile of ****.  Lucky for them they didn't have to worry about this either since nobody stepped up.
How was a small developer supposed to be a success in this environment?  Think about it.  Besides the fact that they would have to rely on the very publishers who are committing this travesty to publish their game they then have to fight through piles of crap that actually have better connections with the retail outlets probably giving them more copies and shelf space.

Offline vudu

  • You'd probably all be better off if I really were dead.
  • NWR Junior Ranger
  • Score: -19
    • View Profile
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #223 on: February 08, 2010, 02:30:37 PM »
~ Capcom ~

good port, rail shooter, bad port, old port, old port, rail shooter, old port, stuff stuff stuff... oh my gosh, is Capcom lazier than NAMCO?
Did you just call Zack & Wiki an old port?!
Why must all things be so bright? Why can things not appear only in hues of brown! I am so serious about this! Dull colors are the future! The next generation! I will never accept a world with such bright colors! It is far too childish! I will rage against your cheery palette with my last breath!

Offline NinGurl69 *huggles

  • HI I'M CRAZY
  • Score: 28
    • View Profile
    • Six Sided Video
Re: The 3rd Party Wall of Shame
« Reply #224 on: February 08, 2010, 02:37:57 PM »
No.  TREASURE ISLAND Z counts as "stuff."  OKAMI is old refuse.  Quit yer Fox News-ing.
:: Six Sided Video .com ~ Pietriots.com ::
PRO IS SERIOUS. GET SERIOUS.